Friday, August 03, 2007

LIBERALS STANDING IN THE WAY OF CHANGE

Sam Smith
 
Bill O'Reilly may be closer to the truth than usual in describing the DailyKos crowd as a hate group. After all, the mundane middle of the Democratic Party defines itself to an extraordinary degree by what it dislikes far more than what policies it supports. There is a mythology among liberals that if we just get rid of Bush, Cheney, Scooter Libby, and Bill O'Reilly everything will be fine. In fact, when you follow their advice and vote as they suggest, you find yourself stuck with Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi.
 
If you spend a lot of time talking with liberals, you find their rhetoric full of anger at certain individuals. You won't hear much talk of aingle payer healthcare or pension return or credit card usury. Putting Scooter Libby in jail is far more important.
 
Liberals didn't used to be like this. There was a time when - instead of just hating Dewey, Taft and Nixon - they actually accomplished things like these:
 
- Regulation of banks and stock brokerage firms cheating their customers
 
- Protection of your bank account
 
- Social Security
 
- A minimum wage
 
- Legal alcohol
 
- Right of labor to bargain with employers
 
- Soil Conservation Service and other early environmental programs
 
- National parks and monuments such as Death Valley, Blue Ridge, Everglades, Boulder Dam, Bull Run, Chesapeake and Ohio Canal, Mount Rushmore, Jackson Hole, Grand Teton, Cape Cod, Fire Island, and San Juan Islands just to name a few.
 
- Tennessee Valley Authority
 
- Rural electrification
 
- College educations for innumerable veterans
 
- Housing loans for innumerable veterans
 
- FHA housing loans
 
- The bulk of hospital beds in the country
 
- Unemployment insurance
 
- Small Business Administration
 
- National Endowment for the Arts
 
- Medicare
 
- Peace Corps
 
Part of the problem is that liberals have become more of a demographic than a movement, and a pretty upscale one at that. Thus the groups that Democrats used to worry about have been left on their own or to be victimized by conservatives who offer them salvation in lieu of a decent job.
 
It isn't that the non-elite is more religious these days, it's just that liberals used to have something to profide in the here and now to compete with the vagaries of the conservative hereafter.
 
The DailyKos crowd is having their annual meeting and getting fond attention from a media that clearly likes their willingness not to rock the boat and to treat politics as a semiotic rather than substantive enterprise.
 
For the record, however, it should be noted that many of those celebrated at this event:
 
- Voted for the Iraq war
 
- Supported the egregious No Child Left Behind law
 
- Have backed to the hilt the cruel and unconstitutional war on drugs, forerunner of the cruel and unconstitutional war on terror.
 
- Supported the Clintons who dismantled social democracy and turned the Democrats into GOP Lite.
 
- Backed NAFTA, the WTO and other assaults on the domestic economy.
 
- Have refused to support single payer healthcare.
 
- Have been remarkably complacent as Bush dismantled the Constitution.
 
In short, it's the sorriest bunch of liberals in over 70 years, which is why the corporate media is so tolerant and the conservatives can continue merrily on their way, often with the help of Democratic votes
 
Opposing Bush and his capos is a necessity but it is not a policy. Until liberals are willing to support something more than a minimum wage that doesn't even bring us back to where we were in 1956, they're really just one more thing standing in the way of change.

43 Comments:

At August 03, 2007 2:27 PM, Anonymous said...

Not to mention from the DailyKos crowd's disdain for free speech and impartial analysis, such as discussion of Project Northwoods...er...I mean BushCo's facilitation and involvement in perpetrating the 9-11 attacks for financial, political, and Israel's gain.

 
At August 03, 2007 3:38 PM, Mairead said...

Too many people who claim the "liberal" label are the ones Phil Ochs sang about in "Love Me, I'm a Liberal". To ring a change on the 17th-c. Earl of Rochester's comment: they rarely say a foolish thing, and rarely do a wise one.

 
At August 03, 2007 3:53 PM, xilii said...

Out of curiosity, what are some programs that liberals could endorse that might actually bear fruit within the next four or five years? Universal health care sounds promising, but what else is there that doesn't involve undoing current programs, such as No Child Left Behind, which would have their own inertia? How could liberals/progressives be more proactive instead of reactive? (I don't know if ending the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan would count.)

 
At August 03, 2007 5:15 PM, Anonymous said...

I cried when they shot John Lennon
Tears ran down my spine
And I cried when I saw "JFK"
As though I'd lost a father of mine
But Malcolm X and Ice-T had it coming
They got what they asked for this time
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

I go to activists speaches
And I put down the old GOP
I love Bill and Eddie and Jamey
I hope every black boy gets on TV
But to take action on what I beleave in
That's asking to much of me !
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

I cheered when Clinton was chosen
My faith in the system restored
And I'm glad to hear white males challenged
For their powerful, CEO boards
I love Hispanics and Negros
As long as they don't take my job
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

The people of state of Texas
Should all hang their heads in shame
I can't understand how their minds work
Dr. Phil needs to set them all straight
But if you want me seem unpatriotic
I hope the cops take down your name
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

I read New republic and Nation
I've learned to take every view
You know, I like the PBS broadcasts,
They show what's novel and new.
But when it comes to times like 9/11
There's no one more red, white and blue
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

I vote for the left-wing candidates,
They want environmnetal laws to be strong.
I go to the Springsteen concerts,
He sure gets me singing those songs.
I'll sign any pettion you show me
But don't ask me to come on along
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

Once I was young and impulsive
I wore every conceivable pin
Even went to the anti-war protests
Learned all the Bob Dylan hymns
But now I've grown older and wiser
And that's why I'm turning you in
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a Liberal

 
At August 03, 2007 5:37 PM, cemmcs said...

You're right. Liberals have lost sight of the big picture. They spend too much time on the defensive.

However, Bill O'Reilly's attack on Daily Kos is completely unreasonable. He has said the organization is comparable to the KKK and and Nazis.

 
At August 03, 2007 8:49 PM, James Wilder said...

I note the usual gang of suspects is out and about doing their good work of trying to persuade the rest of us that 'liberals' pose a greater threat to America than George Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Donald Rumsfeld, and the whole fuggin' Clinton clan combined.

Fortunately, most of the rest of us are too intelligent to pay much attention to their silly-ass antics.

By the way, mairead, would it be possible for you to come up with a new song to warble around the auto-da-fe--er, 'scuse me, campfire? I mean that one's getting a little stale, and from what I've read of Phil Ochs, he wouldn't've liked your type any better than he liked the air-quote liberals either.

 
At August 03, 2007 9:12 PM, Sean O'Neil said...

For someone who likes to accuse others of trolling, Jimmy Wild-boy sure has the trolling line loaded with stinkbait and is looking for channel cats and suckers.

Remember, Jimmy. The stinkier the bait, the more trashy the fish you'll catch.

++++++++++

I may not agree with Sam's decision to support John Edwards, but I definitely agree with his take on "liberals" and "Daily Kos" and those moronic Kossacks, many of whom sound and write just like Jimmy Wild-Boy. They would have the rest of us believe that the Republicans are SO MUCH WORSE and therefore we should forgive the reprehensible greed and absolute prostitution of the Democrats.

I suggest that all of them, including little Jimmy Wild-Boy, go play with Barack, Hillary, Al, and all the rest of the DLC corporados. When the country gets off its arse and starts the real beginnings of change, those "liberals" are going to be shoved into the dustbin of history, right next to those "Rethugs" that they love to hate.

+++++++++++

Nice essay, Sam.

 
At August 03, 2007 9:28 PM, James Wilder (look closely, Sean, maybe you'll be able to spell it correctly next time-Try wiping th said...

Sean O'Neil sounds like quite the little crypto-fascist, doesn't he?
And by the way, dipshit, I'm not the one who's always 'accusing others of trolling'. That would be your friend Mairead, I believe.

You're right about the stinky bait though, Sean. Looks like my foray netted a very large, very trashy specimen very quickly.

 
At August 03, 2007 9:33 PM, James "Wild-Boy" Wilder said...

By the way, Sean--try wiping your gobbets of spittle off the monitor next time. It might help you read what's up there a little more clearly, even if it doesn't serve to make your replies any more coherent.

 
At August 03, 2007 9:36 PM, long time Review reader said...

When I see TPR quoting a scumsuck like Bill O'Reilly approvingly, I know it's high time for me to look elsewhere for progressivist news.

Sorry, Sam. It's been fun, but all things come to an end I guess.

Regretfully--bye.

 
At August 03, 2007 9:59 PM, ellen h. said...

I agree. TPR gets stricken off my Favorites list as of now. This kind of crap will definitely lose you some readers, Sam (myself among them). Judging by what I'm seeing here, the ones they'll be replaced by wiil be nothing for you to brag about.

 
At August 03, 2007 11:01 PM, Anonymous said...

> For the record, however, it should be noted that many of those celebrated at this event:
gle payer healthcare.

- Have been remarkably complacent as Bush dismantled the Constitution.

To back that up, Democrats.com reports there's not a single session devoted to the impeachment issue at Yearly Kos.

It's a shame they put winning elections ahead of doing what's right: Defending and protecting the Constitution. The people who organized Yearly Kos are nothing but Bush/Cheney enablers in my book.

 
At August 04, 2007 12:27 AM, Sean O'Neil said...

A crypto-fascist?

Obviously you don't even know what is fascism, nor what is crytpo.

And obviously you are a DLC stooge who calls himself a "liberal" while supporting the equivalent of a "Rethug."

I suppose if you try to label me with a monniker that better fits YOUR preferences, you are acting even more like the Rethugs. Precisely like Karl Rove.

So what is your story, little Jimmy Wild-Boy? Are you even on the same planet as the rest of us?

 
At August 04, 2007 12:30 AM, Sean O'Neil said...

Hurts to hear that Bill O'Reilly could actually be correct about something.

Hurts to consider the truth about the "liberals".

Hurts to LIE about "single payer health care," pretending it is a fix on our health care problems. Go head, praise Swillary the Swine and her corporate lackey positions on health care. You might as well vote for John McCain or some other GOP candidate.

You people really are lost if you think Sam's off his rocker here. If anything, Sam took it easy on the "liberals."

And by the way, merely pointing out the truth about "liberals" is by no means an indicator of "fascism." Ironically, the "liberals" are the ones who are carrying water for corporate America, which makes THEM the crypto-fascists!

I think Sam can weather the loss of "regulars" who are DLC sycophants.

 
At August 04, 2007 12:33 AM, Sean O'Neil said...

Yearly Kos and its philosophies and and positions are the reason why the Congress gets away with being Bush's Lap Dogs.

The Kossacks make excuses for the Democrat lapdogs.

The Kossacks write convoluted faux-intellectual essays and comments about how the LAPDOG DEMOCRATS actually are trying very hard to counter Mr Bush and the "Rethugs," but simply do not have a "big enough" majority.

Those of you who buy the pap and feces purveyed by the "liberals" of Daily Kos its Kossack Lackeys are the duped ones, the fools, the patsies, the stooges. You have been taken for a ride, and taken for granted, by the party that YOU THINK represents your interests.

Time to grow up, Kossacks.

 
At August 04, 2007 5:51 AM, Anonymous said...

To be a liberal is not of necessity to support the platforms of the DNC--the O'Neill person above might want to clean up his own act before instructing others in the correct use of terminology.

That's a fact obviously way and above too complex for the likes of the tiny minds on display here to digest.

If you've started nodding your bobble-heads in approval at someone like Bill O'Reilly, folks, you are a sad lot of hypocrites to the cause of your much touted 'progressivism'--and Sam, as one poster here mentioned a couple of weeks ago, I'm mighty mich afraid you've been duped into being a fifth columnist for the Republicans, ; but sadly, the mainstream Libertarian banner was hijacked by them a long time ago.

The above posters are right on. The Progressive Review is no place for me anymore. It's certainly ceased to be progressive--and the only thing it seems bent on reviewing these days are the tired hate-mongering, name-calling tactics of the Repugnicans.

 
At August 04, 2007 10:02 AM, Sean O'Neil said...

Nice try Anonymous. If you haven't the sack & stones to say who you are, your comment is fecal matter. And on its substance, it's obviously DLC shilling.

If you love the Kos perspective, you don't agree with Sam. I don't know how it is that you haven't sussed by now the fact that Sam is not a DLC Democrat. Why you would now try to pressure and cajole him into retracting his well-argued essay is beyond logic, and is well into blind partisan shilling.

So while you can pretend at "lecturing" me on this point or that, you are just talking about presentation. You cannot disprove the accuracy of my observations. If you could, you would do so. So instead, you harp on my presentation style.

Nice try, as I said.

But a failing, errant try.

Take your silly platitudes back to your Barney the Purple Dinosaur land of "big happy family" nonsense. The "liberals" are the enemies of freedom and democracy. They have proved it time and again during Mr Bush's tenure.

Your attempt to wipe the diarrheic runnings off their sycophantic arses is pathetic. And it smells really, really bad.

 
At August 04, 2007 10:05 AM, Sean O'Neil said...

Sam a 5th Column for the Republicans?

Oh jay-zus kroyste.

Sam is not even remotely partisan toward Republicans.

What Sam serves is a seasoned, informed view on the truth. He has been correct well more often than wrong.

If you have ever paid attention to reality, you would see that the "liberals" Sam has exposed -- especially o-BOMB-a, the Clintons, and the DLC Corporado Gang -- are the ones who are Republican 5th Columnists.

Be gone, Anonymous. Take your DLC sympathies with you. Nobody cares about your whining juvenilia. Sam will not be hurt by your absence. And the Nation might even benefit from your going back into your la-la land of Laudatory Liberals.

 
At August 04, 2007 11:33 AM, cemmcs@sbcglobal.net said...

Even if you disagree with some of the things thing Sam says, you should not give up on this website because it's one of the few places you get a point of view which is truly independent of the partisan bickering served up by The Democrats and Republicans.

 
At August 04, 2007 2:22 PM, Anonymous said...

You're putting the cart before the horse.

We are in a grave constitutional crisis. There is NO way we're ever going to make any progress on progressive goals like better access to healthcare and education unless we first shore up the very foundations of our system of government.

In 1974, we were in several major crises, including Vietnam, but we had a much bigger problem on our hands that needed to be fixed first before we could even begin to hope for fixing the rest.

Until we sweep out the corruption in the highest levels of our government, there's no way for us to do anything else. Our goals are still there--they always have been--but we can't make any progress on them until we've first gotten rid of our petty dictator and his cronies.

 
At August 04, 2007 2:27 PM, Anonymous said...

When putrid shit like Sean O'Neill gets off of this site and starts venting his muck on the likes of the Limbaugh and O'Reilly shows (where he clearly belongs), I'll consider returning to this site, 11:33. Until then, his own amply spread fecal matter is making it stink too here badly for anyone who doesn't possess the sensibilities of a swine to remain on it. I'm not interested in swatting around opinions with a turd like O'Neill.

 
At August 04, 2007 2:32 PM, Anonymous said...

Sam humanely nailed the posers & the poseurs gathering under the discreet white flag of modern liberalism. All they want is to be left alone to fairly prosper while they portray themselves & their political positions as somehow crucially distinct from standard elephant -think.

Sam could have easily slapped them upside of their silly noggins but chose the practical approach of leavening his sharp analysis w/ a dollop of mercy.

- good work , Sam ! John A. Joslin ( electrician & union member in Detroit )

 
At August 04, 2007 3:11 PM, paul l. said...

The idiotic bashing and name calling I'm seeing here is truly worthy of the O'Reilly/Coulter crowd. Smear, distort, and spew venom over any group whose alleged ideology you don't agree with.

You folks are a great advertisement for "Progressivism". I used to recommend friends to this site, so they could get a better understanding of what the progressive cause is about. After this, no more.

You people have made me ashamed to show anyone this site now.

 
At August 04, 2007 3:13 PM, Anonymous said...

Yeah, 11:33--I can really see how free of "partisan bickering" this site is.

 
At August 04, 2007 3:30 PM, Meredith said...

It's because you have people here who are too stupid to distinguish between an old and proud political philosophy and the maneuverings of a group of opportunistic hacks who've co-opted the name, 3:13.

Get off your fucking prats and read something other than what flashes on a computer monitor once in a while, and you might actuallg glean some information as to what 'liberalism' is all about. Until you can do that, the lot of you sound like poorly educated dolts, which is about what one can expect from most Americans.

 
At August 05, 2007 7:12 AM, Anonymous said...

Bravo, Meredith. Nail on the head.

 
At August 05, 2007 10:44 AM, Mairead said...

Now why do I get the feeling that all the ochsian love-me-i'm-a-liberals here aren't going to leave after all, despite their rhetoric, but instead will go on moaning endlessly about how their right-wing politics and empty lip service is the "real" liberalism.

 
At August 05, 2007 1:11 PM, Meredith said...

My my.

Rush Limburger has his 'dittoheads', and now with Mairead, O'Neill and the like, Sam Smith has a crew of 'dittoheads' all his very own.

Better watch the flaming wit there, Mairead, you wouldn't want to set the computer on fire or anything.

Such a humourless hoyden. At least we liberals have the ability to laugh at ourselves sometimes as well as laughing at you know-nothing trolls.

Sorry hon; I forgot and let the three deadly words pass my lips in dealing with you..."Read a book."

On second thought don't. I'd not wish to be the one to despoil ignorance so pristine.

 
At August 05, 2007 1:17 PM, Anonymous said...

Wilder's right about one thing-- Mairead's type would've made Phil Ochs puke.

 
At August 05, 2007 1:43 PM, Mairead said...

You trolls are just hysterical, really. Is there actually more than one of you, btw? Do you really go in packs like this, or are we really seeing one troll and his sockpuppets?

And why haven't you left yet?

 
At August 05, 2007 3:14 PM, Anonymous said...

The Democratic party used to accomplish things.....

Social Security - BROKE
Socailized Medicine - I HAVE NO INEREST IN PAYING FOR YOUR HEALTH INSURANCE. If you want health care - pay for it out of your own pocket

NAFTA - a overwhelming success - AFRAID TO COMPETE AGAINST ATHIRD WROLD COUNRTY? What a bunch of pussies

The right of UNIONS? Nothing but communism. Employers should have the right to fire anyone for anything. Its there money and there jobs.. You don't like - start your own company and pay whoever whatever you want (called freedom DUH!!!)

You guys are progressive - just regressive!!

 
At August 05, 2007 3:26 PM, Meredith said...

Why Mairead when we find one such as yourself, a veritable Malvolio, ripe in the fullness of her own lofty yet oddly windy righteousness, and forsooth a very Puppet of the Sock herself, with her foot making of such ingress into her mouth as is yet most painful and yet pregnant with unconscious humour as to witness--why then, thou Lady Fool, we canst not help ourselves and do fall as a very throng upon one one who makes such mighty and loud tho' empty pufferies as a very bag of flatulence dost sound.

In other words, Mairead, your own pretentious and pompous posturings masquerading as some sort of wisdom sets you up for raillery.

67+ years, huh? Well verily, there's no fool like an old fool.

 
At August 05, 2007 4:50 PM, Mairead said...

So you lied? You're not leaving?

 
At August 06, 2007 12:13 PM, Sean O'Neil said...

"anonymous" at Aug 4 2007, 2:27 pm --

As usual, when a whiny little Democrat sycophant sees his/her views exposed as boolshyte, he/she must resort to personal invective. It has been said that patriotism is the last refuge of scoundrels. I would revise that to say that blind partisanship resulting in ad hominem attack against truth-tellers is the true last refuge of scoundrels.

And it's interesting that the most vituperative, uninformed and juvenile posts in this thread are by "anonymous" posters who haven't even got the balls to identify themselves.

And they call me and Mairead "trolls"?

What an inversion of reality! What a Karl Rove tactic!

I am not a Sam Smith Dittohead. I have complained to Sam about his support of John Edwards, who is NO DIFFERENT from o-BOMB-a or Swillary the Swine.

You DLC/DNC lackeys can keep believing that the Democrats actually are against the present dictatorship.

Just remember who was correct, when it comes time for you to acknowledge the clampdown. The correct view won't have been your own.

It will have been mine, Mairead's, Sam Smith's, and the view of others who see the truth as we do.

You may now return to your juvenile drive-by anonymous pot-shots that attempt to buttress the lying sacks of fecal matter who call themselves the "opposition party."

 
At August 06, 2007 12:16 PM, Sean O'Neil said...

meredith,

Acting haughty doesn't make your view correct.

You're an embarrassment. You aren't "liberal" -- you should try reading John Stuart Mill's "On Liberty" to find out what is liberalism.

o-BOMB-a is not liberal.

Swillary the Swine is not liberal.

Plaintiff's Whore Edwards is not liberal.

Dennis Kucinich is not liberal.

There are NO LIBERALS in the US Congress.

Keep dreaming, meredith. Your whiny posts and slapdash baseless condescension will not change Sam's mind, nor my mind, nor anyone else's mind.

 
At August 06, 2007 5:49 PM, Richard said...

Sam, we live in postmodern times as you know.

Accordingly, you recognize that you aren't supposed to display any knowledge of history when writing about politics, especially liberalism, which has quite deliberately become the most postmodern of political philosophies, one that acts as if the past never happened, and that it is impossible for people to collectively associate to bring about fundamental change.

--Richard Estes

 
At August 06, 2007 9:04 PM, Anonymous said...

Corruption of ideals goes by increments. Today, it's Bill O'Reilly whom we quote approvingly;--tomorrow, maybe some of A. Coulter's foam-flecked tirades against 'liberals' won't sound so bad.

I'm glad to know that plenty of you folks out there have just the type of cast iron stomachs that are so necessary in times like these.

As for me, I think Kurt Vonnegut said it best:

"Hi-ho";

"And so it goes."

 
At August 06, 2007 9:07 PM, Meredith said...

Sean O'Neill proves himself (yet again) to be a complete gaping rectum by 'quoting' statements in his post at 8/6/12:16 that I never made.

It just goes to demonstrate his own complete paucity of thought that he feels he has to resort to a tactic that stupid.

 
At August 06, 2007 9:27 PM, Richard said...

Sam, you sly old dog

you quote Bill O'Reilly to provoke the standard liberal response, you are such a terrible guy to do it, your ideals are "corrupt", you trick them into showing exactly what they are, people devoid of substance, lacking any ability to help facilitate the creation of a politics that would actually help people instead of rationalizing why the vote for the war in Iraq, why they continue to fund it, why they support a new kind of liberal corporatism

--Richard Estes

 
At August 06, 2007 9:33 PM, Nastykitty said...

If O'Neill's got such a forkin' problem with 'personal invective' being hurled his way, maybe he should try restraining his own use of it somewhat.

Typical O'Reillyite behavior, that. Hurl insults and invective, then start bellyaching and crying about the 'barbarousness'and 'incivility' of those you've maligned when they start slinging a little of your mud back at you.

Right-wing bullies can always dish it out, and they can always be counted on to not be able to take it, lest their own 'sacks and stones' suffer a little abrasion in the process.

 
At August 09, 2007 9:20 AM, Meredith said...

As I said above, too many of the commentators here don't have sufficient understanding of Liberalism, the Liberal movement in politics, or the enormous gains that this philosophy made for millions of working-class Americans, Britons, and Europeans in the years between the end of Queen Victoria's reign and the start of the second World War.

To attempt to learn more about this subject might expose their own predjudices and parrotings to question and even possible revision; and God knows, better by far to persisit in ignorance than run the risk of that.

Instead, you people cravenly follow the lead of an O'Reilly by imitating his know-nothing application of the term "Liberal" to a crew of tired party hacks working for the same corporate masters as O'Reilly's party (the Republicans). Because they've commandeered that term, rather than question their right to it, you people simple-mindedly brandish it to demonize thousands of people who adhere to Liberal priciples and beliefs, but who have no love at all for the DNC shills.

That IS stupidity, and there's no kinder term for it.

If any of you out there are that hopelessly confused as to the meaning and true philosophy of Liberals, and are willing to enlighten yourselves somewhat, I'd suggest you go and get the collected writings of such authors as Gore Vidal and Thomas Frank, and get to reading right now.

As for the rest of you--continue to get your input on Liberalism from the likes of O'Reilly and the Fox News ignoramuses-cum-populist manques. Really, you deserve no better.

 
At August 10, 2007 6:07 PM, Richard said...

Sam is correct, the DailyKos crowd does define itself more by what is against, than what it is for, and that's because, at the end of the day, they will vote for the Democrat on the ballot, and an overemphasis upon substance, or, to be more accurate, an integration of substance and political action, would undermine the ability to deliver money, volunteers and votes through the Internet to Democratic candidates

because, after all, you call them "tired party hacks", but, you still vote for them and will continue to do so, unless they are named Joseph Lieberman

--Richard Estes

 
At August 13, 2007 8:40 AM, Meredith said...

I'd be interested to know, Richard, how you are so certain of my voting record.

Slyboots, have you been hacking somewhere?

Actually, in the last two Presidential elections, I voted for Nader. Prior to that, I've generally gone for the independent or (I'm somewhat ashamed to admit) abstained altogether, because there was truly nothing worthwhile on offer. Perhaps less certainty on your part would add up to greater credibility in your arguments.

 

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